Returning from inside the baseline?

[JJ_DUBZ_87]

Serve form the tramline gives you a clearly advantage, so i understand that is forbidden. I'm not sure that returns inside the court gives you any advantage, other than to distract the server. So i think it shouldn't be banned. Otherwise, yes, it should be banned.

However, if your oponent have a slow serve (no zps, 170-180 KM/H serve for example), why couldn't you stay inside the court?? That's not unreal.

Agreed

[Rob ITST]

This is what I don't get:

Now the scenario is that doing this while holding in RB against someone with a weak serve would be beyond cheap.

If someone has a weak serve, what is wrong with punishing it by chip/charge?

[tigerofintegrity]

I've never done it before except against CPU opponents when I was bored playing them but I don't see why it should be banned or why it should be a problem if it doesn't really do anything. Pretty sure it loses you more points than you would win if you're facing a big server since a lot of your returns are errors.

And if it's a slow serve, then I don't see why you're not entitled to step inside the court on the return to take it early and attack it. That kinda just sounds like tactics to me. Really fail to see how it gives any sort of advantage so it's fine in my book.

Then again, I've never done it before playing anyone and I've never faced anyone doing it before to me so maybe there might be some sort of flaw there I don't know about!

@Avinash - If you stop a match midmatch, that's the equivalent of forfeiting so unless you can prove your opponent did something illegal then you have given your match away. You can't expect to play it again later because you want to. If a player stopped playing a match against Nadal complaining that he took too much time between points and it was throwing his game off and he thinks it should be banned, he would not get to continue that match 2 days later.

[JJ_DUBZ_87]

What I've been reading lately isn't criticism, its name-calling trash talk and imo its disrespectful. I don't see the management as elitist either. From what I see they're trying to stop the multi-thread word war that's been going on between a handful of disgruntled players.

Honestly, I've had enough with the disrespectful degrading trash talk and smart mouthed bickering. I don't know why dudes don't play each other cleanly and settle it on the court, not turning every thread into their own battle zone.

Buut maybe I'm the only one who's thinkin this

[Rob ITST]

I've had enough with the disrespectful degrading trash talk and smart mouthed bickering.

Same here. It seems to be a common theme now:

Someone doesn't like the way someone else plays. The response is to call their game cheap, dirty, etc. Then, the name calling follows.

This is why we lock threads when people argue. Disagreements over how the game is played quickly deteriorate into insults and accusations. If it were't for the guys who are actually commenting on the topic of this thread, it'd probably be locked by now. For now, I guess I'll just have to go through and delete individual posts.

BTW: I've deleted all off-topic and name calling posts. If I have to delete another, I will block the offending member from the forums until management decides what to do with them. This applies to all threads, not just this one. You may discuss and debate all you want, but name calling and fighting will not be tolerated.

[Tamthewasp]

I've had enough with the disrespectful degrading trash talk and smart mouthed bickering.

Same here. It seems to be a common theme now:

Someone doesn't like the way someone else plays. The response is to call their game cheap, dirty, etc. Then, the name calling follows.

This is why we lock threads when people argue. Disagreements over how the game is played quickly deteriorate into insults and accusations. If it were't for the guys who are actually commenting on the topic of this thread, it'd probably be locked by now. For now, I guess I'll just have to go through and delete individual posts.

BTW: I've deleted all off-topic and name calling posts. If I have to delete another, I will block the offending member from the forums until management decides what to do with them. This applies to all threads, not just this one. You may discuss and debate all you want, but name calling and fighting will not be tolerated.

Maybe you should make this as an announcement, then zero tolerance.

[Rob ITST]

It's already an announcement on the forums:

http://www.intertopspintour.net/forum/v ... php?t=9651

Maybe I'll give it a bump.

[ILuvBillVal]

Agreed with the trash talking type behavior on the forums but at least it's limited to a small group of players.

As for the RB return I just think if you're returning that close to the net and holding RB you'll pretty much snap to the net right off your opponent's serve (if possible). I've never tried this but playing people random with high volley setups I've seen them do it and they're right in position at the net when it works.

I just don't see what's so wrong with crafting points, ya know? Hit a nice return and then chip and charge your way to the net. Perhaps part of my problem lies in the fact that it was such a "dreaded low life" type thing in TS3 that it's almost embedded in my subconscious to be revolted by seeing that type of behavior. I'm not entirely sure. All in all I guess I just really saw no real downside to the rule and a few upsides.

[Rob ITST]

Agreed with the trash talking type behavior on the forums but at least it's limited to a small group of players.

True. And I think they know who they are, and everyone else does too. Anywayy....

When I played S&V, I never found it very easy to come to net off a return - I'd miss a lot of returns, and most of the time my guy didn't even try to move forward.

As an offensive baseliner, I find it pretty easy to beat people who try it against me. If they try to stand too close, a fast serve will create an error. If they back up, they can't get close enough to the net.

I think what we might be seeing is a shortcoming of the defensive setups. Without a strong serve, you can't keep the high reflex/high volley guys on the baseline - they can treat all the serves like second serves.

[Dark-Disaster]

I've never had success with this tactic against anybody that is at the same level as me. If your opponent is doing this successfully, it probably means that he is outright better than you or your serve sucks. If the latter is true, then the opponent has every right to attack your weak serve. You guys are saying that this tactic is non existant in real life, but it is common on the pro level to return a weak serve early and take time away from your opponent.

[JJ_DUBZ_87]

I've never had success with this tactic against anybody that is at the same level as me. If your opponent is doing this successfully, it probably means that he is outright better than you or your serve sucks. If the latter is true, then the opponent has every right to attack your weak serve. You guys are saying that this tactic is non existant in real life, but it is common on the pro level to return a weak serve early and take time away from your opponent.

Remember the early 2000's Dementieva matches?? Players were WAY inside the baseline munching on those serves.

[edlglide]

I've never had success with this tactic against anybody that is at the same level as me. If your opponent is doing this successfully, it probably means that he is outright better than you or your serve sucks. If the latter is true, then the opponent has every right to attack your weak serve. You guys are saying that this tactic is non existant in real life, but it is common on the pro level to return a weak serve early and take time away from your opponent.

I agree -- if you are willing to use a character with a weak serve, then it should actually be a weakness. People should be able to step in and attack it.

[ELTXETXU]

Few months ago i was seeing the Masters 1000 of Madrid. I remember that Venus Williams always returned inside the court.

For example: http://youtu.be/VOwwWffIvV8?t=4m58s

[Dark-Disaster]

I've never had success with this tactic against anybody that is at the same level as me. If your opponent is doing this successfully, it probably means that he is outright better than you or your serve sucks. If the latter is true, then the opponent has every right to attack your weak serve. You guys are saying that this tactic is non existant in real life, but it is common on the pro level to return a weak serve early and take time away from your opponent.

I agree -- if you are willing to use a character with a weak serve, then it should actually be a weakness. People should be able to step in and attack it.

Exactly, and this is when people start complaining, when people take advantage of their weaknesses. So what they consider "cheesy" to them is completely harmless to others.

[ILuvBillVal]

Just to clarify in a completely neutral way, I'm not complaining of this being "cheesy" because it has anything to do with any of my weaknesses and I'd entertain any to test that fact. The simple fact of MY bringing it up (I can't speak for everyone else) is that it was banned in TS3 as was tramline serving. I figured they were both the same when I heard tramline serving was banned. I was just surprised to see that it was now legal.