Warm up tournament - ITST to bottom out issues?

[Rob ITST]

Rob doesn't have the game

sorry, couldn't resist.

I knew someone would say that - should have figured it'd be you.

But I have played almost every other tennis game - and I've seen this exact same scenario play out with the release of all those games. Something is hard to counter at first, and everyone starts calling for rules; sometimes it gets worked out by itself, sometimes rules are needed.

Serving is usually the first thing people get good at, and returning is one of the last. So if you start making rules now, you risk serving becoming too hampered and then you have to change the rule.

I think the biggest mistake players make now, at least from the one I played against - is they don't invest enough in reflexes and a returning coach. So they end up with mediocre serve, great baseline skills, but no return skills. So it feels like even thou you got these all court skills - you don't get to use them - hence serve is too good.

I was thinking there was probably a problem like this. No one really fully understands the value of some skills/stats, so most characters are probably too strong in some areas, but also too weak in others. Once people figure out that you need some stat (like reflex), they're going to have to lower another stat (like serve). You'll still have some who create "freaks" - characters that everyone else hates to play, but characters that are too unbalanced to win consistently with. Nothing wrong with that though, and it's something you see in real tennis (think Karlovic).

[riley108]

its true the red serve and power is phenomanal and the return too i played a red stat guy with murray and he blew me off the court, i know for fact if he had respectable stats i would of killed him.. in all honesty i can see a ms and sim tour being created on itst just like ts3 atleast that way tennis lovers can play tennis in simulation and the arcade lovers can play the ms or both for that fact, but it looks almost certain that something has to be done about the red stats especially on power, serve and return

[Baghdad Baghdatis]

tssssssssssssssss,
the game is out very shortly .
how long ??

1 goddamn week !!!!!!!!!!!

so i would say ,guys relax , only because you can´´t handle things at moment ,means not a player is overpowered ,cheese ecetera

hey maybe your skill is simply not good enough at moment !
maybe next week ,after alot of practice or different setup ,the things are looking different

so ,everybody have to come down and play the god damn game !!

seriously i can´t believe whats going on here .

To be honest Goa you don't really have a clue now do you? You go on about Q Reese but in all fairness you always seem to pop your head up saying "calm down", "live with it", "bad losers complain but they can't win" and all that nonsense.

Lets get it clear, I am not getting over excited, far from it. I have not posted anything in any of the TS4 forum threads and I am getting a bit lost with all the threads information and so I am perfectly within my rights to put my thoughts and concerns on the table.

I would not expect a TS3 player who used 90 x 40 max stats, big serve and flat power to have any clue what someone like me could be talking about.

And have you heard yourself "maybe your skills is not good enough at the moment" - what the heck are you talking about? I have not even lost to anyone with monster stats yet and even if I had, so what...man your constant bull turd posts are starting to get onto my nerves.

You stuck your neck into the SIM tour threads when you had no interest or mind set to ever play yet you make all these bold statements full of absolute nothing.

I think you need to stop all these polls about Q Reese and just concentrate on not posting utter rubbish yourself.

[GOA MASTER MDMA]

yeah i can undertand that the truth hurts you ,
screaming about too strong stats ,too strong serve ,that people play too much slices all this crap after a few days where the game is out ...............thats ridicolous !!!
more as R I D I C O L O U S !!

and what the fricking hell have Q.Reese threads to do with that ??????????
nothing at all ,absolutly nothing !!!!
plus you are not long enough a member to understand what was the real deal with Q.Reese


you are nerved when i say ;from all (most) players the skill is not good enough at moment " fine

i´´m nerved (when people start permanently complaining about to strong stats,bad returning ecetera ,after a few days where the game is released !
mean not really nerved , but ..............
no it nerves me .

THIS IS TS4 NOT TS 3

TS4 is a totallly different game !!

no risk ,no 90/40 stats .
so no need to compare old TS3 stuff in a completly new game like TS4 .

the game have changed !!

let us play the game forward .

i think nothing is wrong in TS 4 !!
till now it looks pretty perfectly for me

till now !!
maybe after playing it a month ,i think different .who knows !
but not after a few days

PEACE MAN,

[Baghdad Baghdatis]

yeah i can undertand that the truth hurts you ,
screaming about too strong stats ,too strong serve ,that people play too much slices all this crap after a few days where the game is out ...............thats ridicolous !!!
more as R I D I C O L O U S !!

and what the fricking hell have Q.Reese threads to do with that ??????????
nothing at all ,absolutly nothing !!!!
plus you are not long enough a member to understand what was the real deal with Q.Reese


you are nerved when i say ;from all (most) players the skill is not good enough at moment " fine

i´´m nerved (when people start permanently complaining about to strong stats,bad returning ecetera ,after a few days where the game is released !
mean not really nerved , but ..............
no it nerves me .

THIS IS TS4 NOT TS 3

TS4 is a totallly different game !!

no risk ,no 90/40 stats .
so no need to compare old TS3 stuff in a completly new game like TS4 .

the game have changed !!

let us play the game forward .

i think nothing is wrong in TS 4 !!
till now it looks pretty perfectly for me

till now !!
maybe after playing it a month ,i think different .who knows !
but not after a few days

PEACE MAN,

I can't take you seriously - how can the truth hurt. I have not suffered any screaming losses, and even if I had like i said before it is irrelevant. I think you will find that every talented ITST player could max out stats as they did in TS3 and compete. But again, I don't really know why I am addressing this one because your statement is once again completely random.

The thing is your posts never have one single bit of depth to them, it is full of CAPITAL LETTERS, ?????? & !!!!!!! - man how old are you, 13 years old of something? Perhaps if you approached threads with a bit more class and put your point across rather than shouting like a little girl I might take your opinion on board. But seeing as you don't, well, you might as well be saying nothing at all.

Maybe take a look at Cro, Rob etc and the way they respond - I like to hear other peoples opinions when they have some substance and are backed up with experience and maturity. You seem to have neither and so its no wonder why I lose my patience with you and your approach.

I have just seen other threads of this nature and people are talking about this very subject, and others which are all relevant and are completely open to debate. A key word there for you, 'debate'.

On a separate note my mention of Q Reese is absolutely spot if I am being honest. If I am not mistaken he will post, then you will drop in and trash him. Am i right? Of course I am. The you start polls against him. Am I right? I think you will find I am again. So how is it any different you dropping in on countless occasions on various threads dropping outrageous bombs of immaturity - as I said it is not really your opinion I am incensed with, more your delivery.

You have been around longer than me in ITST? Ok, nice, do you want a badge or something. If you have seen Q Reese "spamming" threads or whatever you call it for 4 years more than me then great, I only need 4 minutes of reading your posts to realize you guys must be a tag team gone bad...

All the time you have been here you have brought nothing to the table in my opinion and as you struggle with the concept of SIM or at least balanced Topspin we are never going to see eye to eye - and no amount of SHOUTING AT ME IN CAPITAL LETTER IS GOING TO CHANGE THAT

[Puttu puttuu]

@ Baggy ! You have my full support on this one , I completely agree with you ... I just dont have the energy to start a rant right now .

I suppose "some" need more time ... They will soon realise what you are talkin about ... well let's hope so .

In the mean time , we need to keep playing some Courrier- Simon matches !

Most fun I have had so far has been playing the 2k open and you ...

Need to play Djarvik ! He seems to ignore my invites !

[ANILTJE]

You know that only Wawrinka and Courier are the saem as the custom characters.

And Lendl even less.

[GOA MASTER MDMA]

BAGDHAD KEBAB ; i have no concern to answer your stupid childish post , i have said all in my preview post .

[Moralspain]

peace guys



btw i played 1 set against Al hours ago and beat me 4-6 but we had good fun, lot of control shots, drop shots and all that stuff. I used Lendl and he used some guy named Ernest Pubis or something like that

[coke4]

First stop would be 2K. Then Rules.

Should we make a thread saying what we would like to be adjusted in the game in the hope that 1k might be listening, it could get out of hand quickly so it would have to be heavily moderated so they will actually read it or we would have to put all the agreed upon points in the opening post?

[tenjintenkai]

I kind of agree with Baghdad. There's no harm in starting to discuss what could be done to make a more "realistic" tour.

Of course the game has just been released and we have to play some time and battle against each other to see the flaws and what is wrong with balance, but on the other hand i think we don't need an astrophysics degree and 4 years of research to realize that 98 power and 98 serve is something that destroy the enjoyment of "itst tennis purists" to play a good game.

Yeah maybe we should look at some gold coaches with special attributes for counter and returns but in a way wouldnt it be sad to be the solution? Like either we are brute force players or counter shots players? Doesnt it narrow the possibility of creating various kind of players and playstyles and taking a toll on the creativity?

I agree that we have to do more testing with the game. I just reached level 19 and got beaten up by Anil 6-1 7-5 (bastard! ) and i plan to experiment with various kind of coaches and also make other completely different players. Then of course i will get more "knowledge" on the balance of the game like Djarvik and others are doing. But i also know that i am already tired of playing mutant because i really hate to waste my time. As Baghdad said its not a matter of win or lose, i lost to some mutants but win most of the time and that doesnt mean i enjoy these matches.

Maybe the list that you'll give to 2K of things to fix is a very good start.
This is something that can't be changed but i am a bit perplex as to the way we asign XP.... for exemple my character has now more than 80 in stamina while it wasnt something i was looking for in the first place. I would have prefer to asign those xp points to reflex for exemple...

[ANILTJE]

I agree. It's pity. I wanted to make Wawrinka the same as in the game. But it ain't possible. All kinds of XP land on places I don't want to

[djarvik]

Rob doesn't have the game

sorry, couldn't resist.

I knew someone would say that - should have figured it'd be you.

But I have played almost every other tennis game - and I've seen this exact same scenario play out with the release of all those games. Something is hard to counter at first, and everyone starts calling for rules; sometimes it gets worked out by itself, sometimes rules are needed.

Serving is usually the first thing people get good at, and returning is one of the last. So if you start making rules now, you risk serving becoming too hampered and then you have to change the rule.

I think the biggest mistake players make now, at least from the one I played against - is they don't invest enough in reflexes and a returning coach. So they end up with mediocre serve, great baseline skills, but no return skills. So it feels like even thou you got these all court skills - you don't get to use them - hence serve is too good.

I was thinking there was probably a problem like this. No one really fully understands the value of some skills/stats, so most characters are probably too strong in some areas, but also too weak in others. Once people figure out that you need some stat (like reflex), they're going to have to lower another stat (like serve). You'll still have some who create "freaks" - characters that everyone else hates to play, but characters that are too unbalanced to win consistently with. Nothing wrong with that though, and it's something you see in real tennis (think Karlovic).

Rob, let me once again say, all tennis games you have seen were different. This time, it is not the case. The game is extremely similar to TS3. In fact, it is TS3 with more animations and way easier controls and less outs and easier serve.

We wont need more then a few ITST matches to see the problems.

You right you, it is a bit to early to tell what is Cheese and what is not. As it stands, big servers are simply boring. But not unbeatable. Problem will arise when the likes of Norberto will start using these Then he will win every match, without missing a fist serve (happens now already) and all matches will be tie break.

Let me say this: we desperately need a solid counter to big servers. As it stands, there will be lots of tie breaks in ITST, again.....

[djarvik]

Need to play Djarvik ! He seems to ignore my invites !

Sorry. Truth is, I am still doing some soul-searching on how I want to play.

Yes, more fun rallies are here, but, at the same time, no outs. If you remember, what I did best in TS3 was to make people miss, now I cant do it.


Sorry Anil and Baggy ...give me some time to find myself, then I will give you a proper match!

[ANILTJE]

I don't really see why it's nice not to have any errors in the game . I really miss the risk shots.